Impossible to Defeat


Back To Prabhupada, Issue 42, Winter 2013/14

The IRM's philosophical position is so strong that even attempts made specifically to oppose this position end up being forced unwittingly to agree with the IRM -- that Srila Prabhupada remains ISKCON's diksa guru. Two examples of this were highlighted in recent issues:

In BTP 39 we saw how ISKCON guru HH Bhakti Vikasa Swami's support for a paper called "Defeat of rtvik-Vada" was a case of supreme illiteracy since that paper, while attempting to defeat the IRM's foundational document, The Final Order, actually ended up supporting its conclusions! (Please see

And, in the last issue we saw how a GBC-supported "Vision Statement", which attempted to support the official GBC guru hoax, actually ended up accepting that Srila Prabhupada is ISKCON's diksa guru.

Now, ISKCON UK have published a document meant to specifically prepare candidates for initiation by one of the GBC's gurus, but again only ends up proving that one should take initiation from Srila Prabhupada! The document is called "ISKCON Bhaktivedanta Manor's Initiation Procedures & Standards Policy", and all quotes in the shaded boxes below are taken from it.

Srila Prabhupada's disciples

"Disciple means Discipline," Srila Prabhupada said [...] it is not recommended for you to regard anyone in particular as your future diksha guru until you have maintained the standard of sixteen rounds and four regulative principles for a minimum of one year".
(P. 3 & 9, emphases in original)

Srila Prabhupada also stated that one is the "disciple" of the one who gives the "discipline", which the document states is chanting 16 rounds and following the 4 regulative principles -- disciplined rules given by Srila Prabhupada:

Srila Prabhupada: "Who is my disciple? First of all let him follow strictly the disciplined rules."
Disciple: "As long as one is following, then he is..."
Srila Prabhupada: "Then he is all right."
(Morning Walk, 13/6/76)

And, indeed, anyone who followed these disciplined rules automatically became Srila Prabhupada's initiated disciple previously.

The Rtvik system

"Regarding Srila Prabhupada as your guru, and carefully studying his books, you can discuss any questions that may arise with your mentor. [...] In those days, on Srila Prabhupada's instructions, everyone practised their devotional life under the guidance of someone more experienced. And Srila Prabhupada also depended on the local temple president to tell him if someone was ready for initiation. So our so-called 'new system' is really just the one that was always there, the one our founder-acarya created."
(P. 8 & 27, emphasis in original)

The document proposes the same system of initiation which Srila Prabhupada established:

a) Srila Prabhupada was one's guru, his books were studied, and any questions could be discussed with senior devotees, since most of Srila Prabhupada's disciples never even saw him;

b) Hence, Srila Prabhupada did not examine candidates for initiation personally, but depended on the recommendation of the temple president. (And after July 9th, 1977, this temple president recommendation went to the local rtvik priest -- see "Letter to all GBCs and Temple Presidents, 9/7/77").

Under this system, Srila Prabhupada automatically became one's initiating guru. And since the document states that this system should be in place now, with, as admitted in the previous section, everyone following the disciplined rules given by Srila Prabhupada for becoming his disciple -- then Srila Prabhupada should also again become one's initiating guru.

Initiated by Srila Prabhupada

"Srila Prabhupada. He wrote his books not simply for his disciples of yesterday, but for the disciples of today. He is not only the founder of the Hare Krishna movement, but the acarya, the spiritual master upon whom all other teachers base their life and teaching. [...] Your mentor will continue to encourage you to listen regularly to Srila Prabhupada's recorded lectures, carefully read his books, and in general discover for yourself the teachings of Krishna consciousness directly as taught by the founder-acarya. This aspect of hearing from Srila Prabhupada is crucial, since he is our perfect example of a guru, both in words and living example."
(P. 8 & 11)

It is stated that one will directly be receiving the transcendental knowledge of Krsna consciousness from Srila Prabhupada as one's spiritual master, in the same way his disciples receive it. This means that one will be initiated by Srila Prabhupada in the same way:

"Diksa actually means initiating a disciple with transcendental knowledge by which he becomes freed from all material contamination."
(Cc. Madhya-lila, 4.111)

"Initiation means receiving the pure knowledge of spiritual consciousness."
(Cc. Madhya-lila, 9.61)

ISKCON's gurus inadequate

"Your guru can also rest assured that even after initiation his disciples will be cared for and given sufficient guidance. This is a crucial need and, as most gurus nowadays cannot provide this personally themselves".
(P.4, emphases in original)

It is admitted that ISKCON's guru hoaxers are not able to provide personal guidance. Srila Prabhupada, however, is providing personal guidance, even in his physical absence:

"I shall remain your personal guidance, physically present or not physically, as I am getting personal guidance from my Guru Maharaja."
(Srila Prabhupada Room Conversation, 14/7/77)


Again, a document based on denying Srila Prabhupada's diksa guru status, actually ends up proving it in toto! The truth cannot be defeated. Thus, we are seeing that no matter who makes the attempt, or how it is done, all roads always end up leading back to Srila Prabhupada's position as ISKCON's diksa guru! Therefore, it would save such persons time and embarrassment if they gave up these futile attempts to defeat Srila Prabhupada's position as ISKCON's guru, and instead just surrendered to him.

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